Towing
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My only advice is sit down when you get a quote for a towbar from Citroen!
The weight and centre of gravity will be fine, if your car is an EGS then be aware the clutch can take a pounding in low speed movement.
The weight and centre of gravity will be fine, if your car is an EGS then be aware the clutch can take a pounding in low speed movement.
We have the auto model which is the electronic gearbox so can use in manual or auto. I know the price is not good from Citroen for a tow bar fitted. So we are going to use the company we used for our last cars tow bar as they do a great job.have you towed with your DS4?
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Thread hi-jack rather than start a new one!
We're going to get a caravan and I'd be interested to hear if anyone pulls a touring caravan with a 1.6HDi manual and their experience; I'm looking at getting a Bailey Orion 440 which has a fully-loaded weight of 1250kg and our car has a kerb weight of 1417kg so from a balance perspective that sounds fine to me, but I'm not sure how the 1.6HDi engine would cope with that sort of train weight - our annual holiday is south west France on the Atlantic coast so it would be travelling at 110km/h on the autoroute for hours on end, plus local shorter trips. I assume anything like an incline will require 5th gear but other than that does the combination work?
One option is to sell and get a 2.0HDi (or even a facelifted 'Blue') to get more power.
I've also decided to not get Citroen to fit the towbar, I can find a few places that do the genuine electrics for about £600.
We're going to get a caravan and I'd be interested to hear if anyone pulls a touring caravan with a 1.6HDi manual and their experience; I'm looking at getting a Bailey Orion 440 which has a fully-loaded weight of 1250kg and our car has a kerb weight of 1417kg so from a balance perspective that sounds fine to me, but I'm not sure how the 1.6HDi engine would cope with that sort of train weight - our annual holiday is south west France on the Atlantic coast so it would be travelling at 110km/h on the autoroute for hours on end, plus local shorter trips. I assume anything like an incline will require 5th gear but other than that does the combination work?
One option is to sell and get a 2.0HDi (or even a facelifted 'Blue') to get more power.
I've also decided to not get Citroen to fit the towbar, I can find a few places that do the genuine electrics for about £600.
Frank,
I dont want to be seen to be a nay-sayer but it is not a combination that I would personally go for.
Technically and by UK regulations you can pull either 100% of the kerb weight or the manufacturers' stated tow limit whichever is the lower. But if you go by the guidelines of the main towing body, the Caravan Club, the accepted safe figure is 85% which puts the figure at 1204 kg for your DS, below the all up weight you quote for your caravan.
We have towed since 1989 the same caravan, an 1989 ABI Marauder 400D, This has an all up weight of 850 Kg and my tow cars have had power outputs of 90 - 132 bhp. My personaldefinition of a successful combo is one that can maintain 60 mph (100 kph) on the flat without undue gear changing and cope with hills with a modest hinderance of other road users. My Montego had around 90 bhp, and was a struggle, my Triumph GT6, just over a 100 was a eye catching tug but boarderline. The initial tow car, a Peugeot 309 SRi (1000kg) was very successful with its petrol 115 bhp, our Xsara (1216Kg) likewise with a HDi 110bhp (still owned) and our Xantia exclusive (132) barely noticed it there !! The point I am illustrating is that 110 was effective pulling its own 1000-1200 kg plus the 850 kg.of our van, the outfit you have suggested has this power to move another 600 Kg which will be a big ask.
A folding caravan is a heavy unit for its size, perhaps the maths of keeping the car and changing the caravan may work out better in the longer run, as having a bigger car for the few weeks of towing annually may be to your financial detriment.
Hope this shines a little more light on a often faced conundrum
D Sport 160
I dont want to be seen to be a nay-sayer but it is not a combination that I would personally go for.
Technically and by UK regulations you can pull either 100% of the kerb weight or the manufacturers' stated tow limit whichever is the lower. But if you go by the guidelines of the main towing body, the Caravan Club, the accepted safe figure is 85% which puts the figure at 1204 kg for your DS, below the all up weight you quote for your caravan.
We have towed since 1989 the same caravan, an 1989 ABI Marauder 400D, This has an all up weight of 850 Kg and my tow cars have had power outputs of 90 - 132 bhp. My personaldefinition of a successful combo is one that can maintain 60 mph (100 kph) on the flat without undue gear changing and cope with hills with a modest hinderance of other road users. My Montego had around 90 bhp, and was a struggle, my Triumph GT6, just over a 100 was a eye catching tug but boarderline. The initial tow car, a Peugeot 309 SRi (1000kg) was very successful with its petrol 115 bhp, our Xsara (1216Kg) likewise with a HDi 110bhp (still owned) and our Xantia exclusive (132) barely noticed it there !! The point I am illustrating is that 110 was effective pulling its own 1000-1200 kg plus the 850 kg.of our van, the outfit you have suggested has this power to move another 600 Kg which will be a big ask.
A folding caravan is a heavy unit for its size, perhaps the maths of keeping the car and changing the caravan may work out better in the longer run, as having a bigger car for the few weeks of towing annually may be to your financial detriment.
Hope this shines a little more light on a often faced conundrum
D Sport 160
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Thanks for the feedback, very useful indeed. I'd worked it out at 88% for the weight of the caravan so wasn't unduly worried by that (especially as that assumes we would have the 'van fully loaded) - it's worth adding we haven't yet bought the caravan either so there are wide options - I'd really like a folding camper but have need given an emphatic 'no' for the family holidays to France, ditto an Eriba Triton which would be well within the weight and I suspect comfortable to tow; the Bailey appears to meet he requirement of (reasonably) light, value for money, quality and layout.
I would have been planning to replace the DS4 next year anyway (buy at 12 months, sell at 4 years) so this would bring that forward a bit although one option is to go for a DSport 160 which is spot-on weight wise and has no concerns over performance - there are a few that would mean £4-4.5k cost to change which is fine and I'm not worried about increased running costs at all to be honest - it does mean we will be buying a 2 year old car though but that's okay. Or I justify £14k on a 'DS' DS4 2.0HDi Prestige as a few are knocking about.
I suspect your concerns over the ability of the engine are very valid and appreciate your thoughts and experience.
I would have been planning to replace the DS4 next year anyway (buy at 12 months, sell at 4 years) so this would bring that forward a bit although one option is to go for a DSport 160 which is spot-on weight wise and has no concerns over performance - there are a few that would mean £4-4.5k cost to change which is fine and I'm not worried about increased running costs at all to be honest - it does mean we will be buying a 2 year old car though but that's okay. Or I justify £14k on a 'DS' DS4 2.0HDi Prestige as a few are knocking about.
I suspect your concerns over the ability of the engine are very valid and appreciate your thoughts and experience.
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Well, the caravan has been bought;
It's being delivered from stock - Bailey Pursuit 430/4 with a maximum weight of 1229kg. Still haven't decided on replacing the car with a 2.0 and whether to go all-out on a 'DS' DS4 but having bought the 'van new perhaps not. Or try our current car and see if it's okay
It's being delivered from stock - Bailey Pursuit 430/4 with a maximum weight of 1229kg. Still haven't decided on replacing the car with a 2.0 and whether to go all-out on a 'DS' DS4 but having bought the 'van new perhaps not. Or try our current car and see if it's okay
Frank,
It is certainly a fine caravan, and I am sure you will find pleasure in the coming years of touring.
As I mentioned I tow with a Xsara HDi 110, it goes well, it has proved to be stable and pretty economical. Excluding passengers the basic stats have this outfit pulling 18.7 kg per bhp. Your new set up works out at a 28.6% increase, at 24 kg per bhp. Towing with our Montego back in the 90's was 'not too relaxing' with a figure of 21.7 so you can understand if I am concerned.
I hope the new combo works for you, but I hope also you will appreciate if I express my concerns, pulling a caravan with an under powered car can have consequences greater than simply slow progress up a hill.
Kind regards
DSport 160
It is certainly a fine caravan, and I am sure you will find pleasure in the coming years of touring.
As I mentioned I tow with a Xsara HDi 110, it goes well, it has proved to be stable and pretty economical. Excluding passengers the basic stats have this outfit pulling 18.7 kg per bhp. Your new set up works out at a 28.6% increase, at 24 kg per bhp. Towing with our Montego back in the 90's was 'not too relaxing' with a figure of 21.7 so you can understand if I am concerned.
I hope the new combo works for you, but I hope also you will appreciate if I express my concerns, pulling a caravan with an under powered car can have consequences greater than simply slow progress up a hill.
Kind regards
DSport 160
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544 Posts
I've certainly not decided yet!
To be fair the 40bhp per ton calculation doesn't really take into account torque - a 120bhp 1.6VTi won't pull anything quite as well as the 1.6HDi!
Anyway, looking to close a deal on a DS4 2.0HDi tomorrow.
To be fair the 40bhp per ton calculation doesn't really take into account torque - a 120bhp 1.6VTi won't pull anything quite as well as the 1.6HDi!
Anyway, looking to close a deal on a DS4 2.0HDi tomorrow.
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544 Posts
New (well, 2015) DS4 2.0HDi 'blue' DSport 150 being collected tomorrow morning
Frank,
How are you getting on with the caravan ? We have surprisingly made a decision to upgrade our caravan and in the space of 4 weeks decided, researched, dealer visited, ordered and (on Friday) collected our new out of the box Luna Stellar, tipping the scales at 1230 max similar to yours.
In naming terms Stella(r) became Stella Artois so the DS is now Renee, but I will post this only once (grins).
Can I ask what nose weight you set when towing with your DS ?
Regards
DSport
How are you getting on with the caravan ? We have surprisingly made a decision to upgrade our caravan and in the space of 4 weeks decided, researched, dealer visited, ordered and (on Friday) collected our new out of the box Luna Stellar, tipping the scales at 1230 max similar to yours.
In naming terms Stella(r) became Stella Artois so the DS is now Renee, but I will post this only once (grins).
Can I ask what nose weight you set when towing with your DS ?
Regards
DSport
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544 Posts
The caravan great, the tow car less so...
For noseweight I wasn't too accurate over it, I tried a few different combinations of moving the awning over the axle until the car ""˜sank' the right amount at the rear - I have to say it towed incredibly stable, shame about the cooling fault which led to it being part exchanged.
Not sure about the 160 but the 150 has integerlactic gearing which meant it spend much time in 5th rather than 6th unless cruising at an indicated 65 on the flat (my Passat is much happier at 60 or a slight incline)
For noseweight I wasn't too accurate over it, I tried a few different combinations of moving the awning over the axle until the car ""˜sank' the right amount at the rear - I have to say it towed incredibly stable, shame about the cooling fault which led to it being part exchanged.
Not sure about the 160 but the 150 has integerlactic gearing which meant it spend much time in 5th rather than 6th unless cruising at an indicated 65 on the flat (my Passat is much happier at 60 or a slight incline)
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